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todd_r
Pro Poster
Username: todd_r

Post Number: 89
Registered: 08-2008
Posted on Monday, November 02, 2009 - 09:48 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Residents and interested parties are invited and encouraged to comment on a draft Knife River Pollution report through Nov 11. Knife River is on Minnesota’s list of impaired waters because of turbidity (sediment). Those interested in the report can also attend a public meeting from 7:00 to 9:00 p.m. on Wednesday, Nov. 4, at the South St Louis County Soil and Water District office located at 215 North 1st Avenue East, Room 302, Duluth MN. The report is available at www.pca.state.mn.us/water/tmdl/project-kniferiver.html
Our state and local agencies seek local participation from residents who live and play within the watershed, to assist in making the best land use decisions for the restoration of Knife River.
For more information, contact Todd Ronning at 834-5160
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jackburton
Regular Poster
Username: jackburton

Post Number: 24
Registered: 06-2009
Posted on Monday, November 02, 2009 - 12:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Turbidity is pretty obvious in the Knife River after a good rain storm. It flows red with clay. When I was a kid we used to innertube the river after big rains and it was much clearer then.
I fish a lot of north shore streams. The Stewart River is picking up alot more sediment, mostly brown like gravely sediment.
How much is natural and how much is due to clearing and logging I don't know, but I can't help but notice the difference over the last few decades.
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frosted_flakes
Pro Poster
Username: frosted_flakes

Post Number: 720
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Monday, November 02, 2009 - 02:19 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Don't the rivers run through raw red clay banks? Every river carries sediment. You can not expect a river that runs through red clay to carry just gravel to it's mouth.
The worm has turned, but it looks the same on both ends.
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jerry_n
Pro Poster
Username: jerry_n

Post Number: 211
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 06:11 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Todd,

Maybe a good time to remind us all what turbidity is. I know you explained it once to me regarding Waterfront Drive but maybe you could refresh our memories.

I am all for keeping our streams clear. I remember Little Stewart after a real hard rain. The river was brown. Didnt stop us kids from having fun though did it?

My mother in law lives in KR so I do have an interest in this but I will not be able to make it on the 11th. I will be remembering the anniversary of the Fitz going down.

One last note, it seems the word Pollution is used here. To me, that infers we, as people, are responsible for this. Are we? If so, how?
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todd_r
Pro Poster
Username: todd_r

Post Number: 91
Registered: 08-2008
Posted on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 08:42 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

FF you are correct, the Knife, and other North Shore streams flow through clay and thus all have some level of naturally occuring sediment. Its thought that some events and land use practices have likely created conditions that have made this situation worse over the years. For example, the original settlement of the North Shore saw the native pines cut off, no planting was done and aspen and birch replaced them. A conversion from conifer to deciduous. Conifers hold a lot more water in their foliage than leafed trees in rain events, thus reduce runoff events. Perhaps, land owners and managers could encourage the planting of conifers? Another current practice that might be having and impact on the river, is the practice of dynamiting beaver dams. It seems, the DNR manages the river for steelhead, and remove spawning barriers like beaver dams. Beaver dams are great retainers of water volume and also are good for places for sediment to settle out of water. When the dams are blasted, the river flows become higher and flashier, thus allowing more scouring of clay banks and releasing of previously settled out sediment from the beaver ponds. Increased sedimentation means river bottoms become embedded with sediment which decreases habit for forage species. All those little bugs and critters that the trout feed on need the nooks and crannies of the river bottom for habit. When they fill in with dirt, the trout lose forage and disappear.
I've heard several claims similar to Jackburton's, that folks have noticed the changes in their lifetimes.
Jerry, here is the link to that previous conversation http://www.twoharborsforum.com/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=7&post=28385#POST2838 5
I used the word pollution, since the PCA used the word pollution. Technically, the report is called the Knife River TMDL (Total Maximum Daily Load) Thats a mouthful and I think people get tuned out when those kind of acronyms are used, so I used the more recognizable term, pollution.
I'm not going to claim to have the answers, but I will claim the best solutions will result if the locals get involved in the process. The process is beginning, and if the locals are absent, the agency people will make all the decisions (DNR, County, PCA, etc.)
There is another group being formed, or reborn, as it was formed many years ago. Its called the Knife River Stewardship Committee. The initial meeting was in October and there were many agency folks there, but zero citizens. The next meeting will be in January, and I will post notice of that prior. The agency folks want to make the best decisions and they welcome involvement from the citizens and can learn much from the locals who've lived within the watershed their whole lives.

P.S. The PCA meeting is tomorrow, the 4th, though the comment period is open through the 11th.
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petitcheval
Pro Poster
Username: petitcheval

Post Number: 895
Registered: 03-2005


Posted on Monday, June 14, 2010 - 11:55 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I discovered a new recent dump of about 20 windows in the woods about a 1/4 mile from W Knife River down a dirt road. I reported it and hope to cause a barricade to go up that will prevent any more cars and trucks from the ability to drive down to the river due to the gross negligence of the person or persons who finished their home improvement project, but did not apparently feel the need to figure in the cost to dispose of the discarded windows properly. Well, they messed it up for everyone. This has to stop. I will be working on solutions to make it easier for everyone to put their unwanted items in the appropriate place. I hope it will work. Wish me luck...or join me in helping make that happen. I have ideas and so do you. Let's do our part to clean up our own act here. Our part of the state is basically a giant watershed. It's really the same premise as the bp incident when you think about it. Just on a much smaller scale, yet the basic greed instinct is just as apparent. Is this what we're supposed to be proud of to be an American?
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frosted_flakes
Pro Poster
Username: frosted_flakes

Post Number: 845
Registered: 04-2008


Posted on Tuesday, June 15, 2010 - 07:48 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You can thank the WLSSD for the litter in our area. Before they got involved in our area, we had a local dump that was not hurting anything and people used it.
Two Harbors. Love it or leave it.
Just leave it alone.
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petitcheval
Pro Poster
Username: petitcheval

Post Number: 896
Registered: 03-2005


Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 04:21 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Access, affordability - Yes, I don't think I remember any dump but Castle Danger, but too bad there can't be one in an abandoned gravel pit or something that could have a liner put in. I know it's complicated, but the alternative of not having a central place is terrible too. What do ya do?
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frosted_flakes
Pro Poster
Username: frosted_flakes

Post Number: 848
Registered: 04-2008


Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 04:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Why would you want to use a gravel pit and put in a liner? We have the best earth around to stop water seepage. Good old red clay. The MPCA had Lake County dig water quality test wells on the perimeter of the Castle Danger dump. They didn't get the bad water seepage results they wanted so they had them dig some more. Same results. No seepage. There is nothing wrong with that dump site, in my opinion. Of course, I have been wrong often in the past.
Two Harbors. Love it or leave it.
Just leave it alone.
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todd_r
Pro Poster
Username: todd_r

Post Number: 160
Registered: 08-2008
Posted on Wednesday, August 25, 2010 - 10:03 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Knife River Clean-up Plan
Neighborhood information session
Wednesday August 25, 2010
4:00 - 6:00 p.m.
Segog Park, Two Harbors

Do you own land in the Knife River watershed? Do you want to protect your land and river for future generations?

Come learn about the clean up plan (TMDL) that's underway and how landowners can get involved.

Questions? contact Andrew Slade
Minnesota Environmental Partnership
aslade@cpinternet.com
218-727-4873

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